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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2015 15:38:50 GMT -6
Orson Scott Card? If not, I'm always looking for new and good how-to books, so gimme details ![:P](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/tongue.png) Thank you, I appreciate that. I don't know when it became so bad! i suppose the argument is "Mary Sues are boring because they are perfect and everyone loves them and blah blah." So. What. No one's getting hurt. Maybe it's envy. "I can't write or be creative at all, so I will destroy others' work".
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Post by Daedric Cat on Mar 29, 2015 15:44:51 GMT -6
Ben Bova. Don't remember the title. It's an old book, but good.
You're welcome.
All Mary Sue means is a character I don't like. Some call any female OC pairing with a canon male a Mary Sue. Note that they didn't say male OC.
Yep. Jealousy. In a nutshell.
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Post by Lady MorningStar on Mar 29, 2015 15:47:30 GMT -6
I think one reason is that the hunters like to feel superior to those they are making fun of.
One "attack" that particularly amused me; One of the MS hunters decided to start badgering me and suggested that I stop focusing on Dagoth Ur and go out and find an actual man and have a real relationship. She also said that I really needed to go out and see what the real world was like.
I responded by telling her that not only do I have an actual living flesh and blood man in my life, we've been married for ten years. I went on to mention that we had just celebrated our anniversary and he had given me a new powerful zoom lens for my camera which was very important in my line of work.
My response then included a link to the website I had at the time which displayed my paintings alongside the photographs of North American wildlife that I had taken myself all over the "American west" and used as references. I told her that if she saw anything on my site that she liked and could afford all major credit cards were accepted. Personal checks were as well, but there would be a waiting period until the check cleared.
I never heard from her or anyone from the LJ group ever again.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2015 15:49:10 GMT -6
Ben Bova. Don't remember the title. It's an old book, but good.
You're welcome.
All Mary Sue means is a character I don't like. Some call any female OC pairing with a canon male a Mary Sue. Note that they didn't say male OC.
Yep. Jealousy. In a nutshell.
Ben Bova. Good one, though I've not read his stuff in ages. Yeah, usually it's the female, though occasionally you see the title Marty Stu get thrown around for guys. Maybe as I get more, um, exposure, I'll attract some fools. Xevak (Nyx's friend and Xivilai bodyguard) can punch them into next week ![:D](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/grin.png)
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Post by Daedric Cat on Mar 29, 2015 15:54:57 GMT -6
I think one reason is that the hunters like to feel superior to those they are making fun of. One "attack" that particularly amused me; One of the MS hunters decided to start badgering me and suggested that I stop focusing on Dagoth Ur and go out and find an actual man and have a real relationship. She also said that I really needed to go out and see what the real world was like. I responded by telling her that not only do I have an actual living flesh and blood man in my life, we've been married for ten years. I went on to mention that we had just celebrated our anniversary and he had given me a new powerful zoom lens for my camera which was very important in my line of work. My response then included a link to the website I had at the time which displayed my paintings alongside the photographs of North American wildlife that I had taken myself all over the "American west" and used as references. I told her that if she saw anything on my site that she liked and could afford all major credit cards were accepted. Personal checks were as well, but there would be a waiting period until the check cleared. I never heard from her or anyone from the LJ group ever again. Bwa ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!!!!
That's what I call burn.
Love it when they assume that you have no life.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2015 15:55:56 GMT -6
I think one reason is that the hunters like to feel superior to those they are making fun of. One "attack" that particularly amused me; One of the MS hunters decided to start badgering me and suggested that I stop focusing on Dagoth Ur and go out and find an actual man and have a real relationship. She also said that I really needed to go out and see what the real world was like. I responded by telling her that not only do I have an actual living flesh and blood man in my life, we've been married for ten years. I went on to mention that we had just celebrated our anniversary and he had given me a new powerful zoom lens for my camera which was very important in my line of work. My response then included a link to the website I had at the time which displayed my paintings alongside the photographs of North American wildlife that I had taken myself all over the "American west" and used as references. I told her that if she saw anything on my site that she liked and could afford all major credit cards were accepted. Personal checks were as well, but there would be a waiting period until the check cleared. I never heard from her or anyone from the LJ group ever again. I can't begin to tell you how awesome that is. I used to belong to an LJ comm dedicated to mocking WoW Rp'ers, called bad_rp. Then I realised it was mean and nasty and I quietly left. I went in looking for some guidelines on what would be a good rp character. I'm glad I didn't listen to them, else Nyx wouldn't be around. Moonguard server there has a reputation of being the porny RP place. SO? I went there once. It wasn't awful. My computer didn't get an STD. And even if it was bad, so what? People were having fun! Also, even if you didn't have a life? SO? Not their business. One's life is what gives THEM fulfillment, not what other people think it should be.
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Post by Lady MorningStar on Mar 29, 2015 15:59:44 GMT -6
I'd like to think that person got a lesson about making assumptions, but most of them are so hard-headed and narrow minded that very little gets through to them.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2015 16:03:51 GMT -6
Sadly enough, yes.
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Post by The Mad God on Mar 29, 2015 21:32:13 GMT -6
Art inherently involves putting a part of yourself into the piece. That isn't making a mary sue. That's doing art at all.
While I was only consious of it in a few cases at the time, I think a lot of the dialogue I wrote for the various Heartwights was reflecting on the feelings I often have of being outcast and despised.
Tureynul clinging to a time before he found himself on the outside looking in. Uthol in denial and carrying on as though this were all a temporary setback. Arynys lashing out and striking back with small gestures that might add up to something in a future too distant to really see. Vemyn dismissing everyone else as irrelevant and turning inward. Endus throwing himself into his work to distract from the isolation. Odros working on self-improvement projects in order to help build up his self-esteem. Gilvoth pushing people away and afraid to let himself trust. Voryn, the only one who can see the light at the end of the tunnel, taking precautions but opening himself up as much as he dares to try to nurture that distant spark of hope.
Where else are you going to get the emotional resonance, the verisimilitude, but from inside yourself?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2015 5:18:31 GMT -6
Indeed so, so I have to wonder, when did it become such a bad thing?
Unless what they're really squawking about is basing an entire character on every aspect of yourself and then using it as wish fulfillment? But even so, who cares?
Too many people ordering others on how to have fun.
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Post by Lady MorningStar on Mar 30, 2015 9:22:09 GMT -6
I think the internet has had a lot to do with it. Overall the internet has been beneficial, but there has been some negativity as well. Prior to the internet (yes, I am one of those relics who remembers life before the world wide web), I don't recall things like fan-base wars. The web can be used as a mask, allowing people to say things and act out in ways that they normally would not. That Live Journal community I just mentioned described itself as a group of people who cared about quality writing, but they were nothing more than a group of bullies who enjoyed picking on and upsetting people. They labeled every fic writer as "sad" and having "no life". Often they would target a writer for no reason other than the fact that her main character was pretty. Hell, I don't believe many of them actually took the time to read the stories that they were making fun of. They were a flock of rabid sheep. The leaders would select someone for them to pick on and off they would go...and they backed off real quick when their target turned out not to to be the sad, no-life shut-in that they believed him or her to be. Typical bullies. And on a more positive note; it's good to hear from our resident Mad One again. ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png) I hope all is well with you.
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Post by Daedric Cat on Mar 30, 2015 15:36:51 GMT -6
Art inherently involves putting a part of yourself into the piece. That isn't making a mary sue. That's doing art at all. While I was only consious of it in a few cases at the time, I think a lot of the dialogue I wrote for the various Heartwights was reflecting on the feelings I often have of being outcast and despised. Tureynul clinging to a time before he found himself on the outside looking in. Uthol in denial and carrying on as though this were all a temporary setback. Arynys lashing out and striking back with small gestures that might add up to something in a future too distant to really see. Vemyn dismissing everyone else as irrelevant and turning inward. Endus throwing himself into his work to distract from the isolation. Odros working on self-improvement projects in order to help build up his self-esteem. Gilvoth pushing people away and afraid to let himself trust. Voryn, the only one who can see the light at the end of the tunnel, taking precautions but opening himself up as much as he dares to try to nurture that distant spark of hope. Where else are you going to get the emotional resonance, the verisimilitude, but from inside yourself? Exactly.
You certainly brought the Brothers Dagoth to life and LadyM really added to them. They used to be indistinguishable to me. I couldn't keep track what ash vampire was where.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2015 17:54:20 GMT -6
I think the internet has had a lot to do with it. Overall the internet has been beneficial, but there has been some negativity as well. Prior to the internet (yes, I am one of those relics who remembers life before the world wide web), I don't recall things like fan-base wars. The web can be used as a mask, allowing people to say things and act out in ways that they normally would not. That Live Journal community I just mentioned described itself as a group of people who cared about quality writing, but they were nothing more than a group of bullies who enjoyed picking on and upsetting people. They labeled every fic writer as "sad" and having "no life". Often they would target a writer for no reason other than the fact that her main character was pretty. Hell, I don't believe many of them actually took the time to read the stories that they were making fun of. They were a flock of rabid sheep. The leaders would select someone for them to pick on and off they would go...and they backed off real quick when their target turned out not to to be the sad, no-life shut-in that they believed him or her to be. Typical bullies. And on a more positive note; it's good to hear from our resident Mad One again. ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png) I hope all is well with you. Rabid sheep... there's a horror film about zombie sheep. This sounds very much like that, those people. Well, I remember those days, too! I didn't even know it existed in a somewhat modern form until 1999 or so. I remember trying AOL back in its hyday, and go fed up pretty fast. I remember walking into a chat based rp group and trying to get involved. I got soundly rebuffed, even though they said it was an open group. Mind, I was kind of clueless and expressed annoyance at how no one was replying to my greetings, which might have had something to do with it, but they were disproportionately rude. I didn't try anything like it again for ages. I think that's all it is with those groups: cliques of bullies. I figure Nyx will have hit the big time when they start coming after me ![:D](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/grin.png)
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Post by The Mad God on Mar 30, 2015 18:00:53 GMT -6
And on a more positive note; it's good to hear from our resident Mad One again. ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png) I hope all is well with you. I've been alright. I poke my nose in regularly, but for a while haven't really had much to say. I did recently finish writing a Fullmetal Alchemist fanfic I've been poking at on and off for the past five years. (My characters immediately demanded a sequel where they go to Hogwarts. ![:P](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/tongue.png) ) I took a trip down to Florida to visit family last week. The time down there was enjoyable. The drive down with four cats loose in the car was significantly less so. ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png)
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Post by Daedric Cat on Mar 30, 2015 18:01:48 GMT -6
That's what it all boils down to- cliques and bullying.
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